‘Yar’Adua Has Failed’

Ghali Umar Na’Abba, former Speaker, House of Representatives

– Ghali Umar Na’Abba, former Speaker, House of Representatives
By Suleiman Anyalewechi, Kano
You were once the speaker of the House of Representatives and for some years now you have been out of power. How does it feel like to be out of the system for some time?
Well for me really, it has been very frustrating. Not because I no longer occupy the office. But because I have not been able to check some of the things that have been going on in the country in the last seven years. You can agree with me that a lot of evils have been going on and I feel sad that those who are supposed to do something against those evils have not been doing so. And I feel that if I had been there, some of these evils, would not have taken place. So this is my only frustration and regret.
Besides this, there is nothing to regret about leaving the office. After all, before I went there, I was not in power. And when I was there, I knew and appreciated the fact that one day I would leave the office. And now that I am out of the office, I still feel the same, because like I said earlier right from the beginning, I knew I would leave the office, whether I liked it or not, it was just a matter of time. However, as I said before, my only regret is that I can not help in checking certain things I feel are not done correctly in the interest of the nation.
Yes, it is on record that while you were in office you did your best to check what many believe were the excesses of the former president, leading to you having a frosty relationship with the then executive arm of government. How would you compare the present National Assembly with your own time, in terms of performance of its role?
I don’t think it would be right to make comparison between the National Assembly of my time and the present one. I would rather leave it for Nigerians to judge for themselves. What I would rather say is that there was relative independence between 1999 and 2003 at the National Assembly compared with the subsequent National Assembly.
How would you react to the recent disagreement between the Senate and House of Representatives over the venue for presentation of the budget by the president?
This is a very unfortunate development, I must say and even if disagreement arises, I believe that some degree of maturity is required by any member of the National Assembly in handling them. Joint sessions are normally held in the chamber of the House of Representatives. If you look at the set up at the National Assembly, you would see that the chamber of the House of Representatives is bigger than that of the Senate and ordinarily should host any occasion like joint sessions of the National Assembly. In essence, it is more convenient to host any joint session of the National Assembly in  the chamber of the House of Representatives than to do so in the Senate. And since 1999, it has been the tradition for any joint session to be held in the chamber of the House of Representatives. But trying to change this tradition because somebody feels he is so important would not augur well for our democracy. In any case, there is nothing like chairman of the National Assembly. This is because in my understanding, the Senate president used his power as the chairman of the National Assembly to change  the traditional arrangement. He is leader, and I believe it was wrong for him to have done that. And like I said earlier, there is nothing like the chairman of the National Assembly in an executive form.
The two chambers of the National Assembly are distinct from each other. But what is important is that in this kind of arrangement, we follow conventional wisdom. And that saves us from embarrassment. Now they have embarrassed the National Assembly, whether they like it or not.
The disagreement over the venue for the budget presentation was simply what can be termed as the climax of a frosty relationship or power tussle between the Senate and House of Representatives. During your time, did you have cause to disagree with the Senate Leadership and if you did, how did you manage to keep it away from the public?
I and my counterpart in the Senate, particularly the late Chuba Okadigbo and Pius Anyim managed the affairs of the National Assembly with a high sense of maturity. Of course, friction can not be ruled out between the two chambers. We had our differences, but because of the maturity we displayed, we were able to handle them without embarrassing the National Assembly. And a lot of times, what used to happen was that if any of the chambers wanted anything, the other chamber would let go. So that was the way we used to manage the affairs of the National Assembly. We related with each other very well, both at the leadership level and individual level.
Particularly, the heads of the two chambers related very very well and therefore, there was no need for open confrontation at any time. This being the case, we never allowed any disagreement to degenerate to the extent of quarreling before the public as obtains today. For instance, when the debate on the establishment of the NDDC was going on, my deputy came and told me that he would love to have the headquarters in Port Harcourt , instead of Yenagoa. But then the Senate wanted the Headquarters in Yenagoa. Then, what I did was that I went to the Senate President, then Okadigbo and informed him about my deputy’s wish. There and then, he said Mr. Speaker, that is done. And that was how the matter was settled and today you have the headquarters in Port Harcourt . There was no friction. The Senate President simply talked to his people and they conceded. And I can tell you, that a lot of issues were resolved in like manner throughout our tenure.
You once left the PDP for AC and now you are back to the PDP. What actually necessitated your exit from the party that brought you into political lime light in the first place and why are you back?
You see, when Obasanjo was the president, there were so much problems between him and myself and also with some other people. So during the re-registration exercise in 2005, Obasanjo gave instructions that some of us must not be registered in the party. And you know registration is very vital to anybody to claim membership of a party or any organization for that matter. He took the decision because he never wanted us to attend the party’s congress billed for that period and he knew that the only way to stop us was to ensure that we were not registered as members. He never wanted us to participate at the congress, because he didn’t want us to oppose his choice of party executives which he had lined up. Neither did he also want our supporters to participate. And all these, were for the sake of his self succession bid. It was after they had finished the congress that they came to us and asked us whether, we wanted to be registered or not. But before they came to us, we had taken the decision to leave the party and form another party so that we could fight the self succession bid of Obasanjo and also to use it to wrest power from him because of the evils he was designing.
That was why and how I left the PDP. For me then, the party had shown that it did not want us. We subsequently formed the A.C. I had thought that after that experience with dictatorship in the PDP, members of the A.C would have learnt sufficient lessons on how to be democratic. So even in AC, some of those people who we established the party with became even more undemocratic than the PDP under Obansanjo.
Because of that, I left the party. When president Umar Yar’Adua decided that the PDP should establish a reconciliation Committee to come and appeal to some of us to come back, I decided to come back to the PDP, more so, since Obasanjo no longer have control on the party. So, that was why and how I went back to the PDP.
How do you evaluate the current state of affairs in the country?
Well, the fact of the matter as of today is that, there is a general weakening of the state due to lack of effective governance. The fact is that, to the people with hindsight the state is failing. But to some people, it is business as usual, everything is going on well. But for me I know that the state is failing. And this sign of failure can be seen by the general frustration among the majority of the populace of this country. As far as I am concerned, my philosophy is that any attempt to measure how happy people are must be predicated upon policies that give impetus to the people to achieve economic progress. And as far as I am concerned this has not been achieved so far by this administration. That is the fact of the matter.
Nigerians up till now, have not known any difference between their condition before 2007 and their condition now. This is the fact of the matter.
In this case, do you think it is morally right for Yar’Adua to seek re-election in 2011 and as a member of the PDP, do you think PDP would be doing itself any good by presenting the President as its presidential candidate again?
Well, I believe that it is Yar’Adua’s right to seek re-election. It is definitely his right. But whether it is morally right or wrong, is a matter of interpretation by different people, with different interest. So it is a rather subjective question for me to comment on. As a party member what is available to me is what I would go for. It does not matter, whether I like the way he runs the government or not. If there is no body to challenge him as a president, then of course, I am bound as a loyal party member to support his bid. But what I have said is the truth concerning the performance of his administration. And even in front of him (Yar’Adua) I would tell him. I told Obansanjo the same severally and therefore I don’t see any reason why I can not tell Yar’Adua
But as far as election is concerned in the presidential election, I would definitely have to vote for him.
But if you were in President Yar’Adua’s shoes and going by his health conditions, would you still contest?
You see, where you stand depends very much on where you sit. I am not sitting in the presidential villa. And also, I am not the one who is not well. If I were the one who is not well, then, I can now determine whether to re-contest or not. I am not someone to rejoice over another person’s misfortune. I believe that anybody can be sick. I believe anybody can be in Yar’Adua’s situation. I wish him a speedy recovery. However, the truth is that his condition is affecting the country and it is up to Nigerians to decide whether they want a Yar’Adua’s presidency again in 2011 or not. But in power arrangement, you find out that a lot of times, it is not the person in power that wields the power. Some of these powers are wielded by their wives, by those close and around them. And these people, naturally would want the person in power to continue so that they would continue to enjoy.
A lot of times, those holding power don’t enjoy it. That is the truth. But all the same, they have to be there for those people around them. And a lot of times, under this kind of arrangement, the wives want that position to be maintained, the cronies want the position to be maintained. And those who generally enjoy the person being there, would definitely not be happy with the situation, whereby the person would be leaving. So, a few people would sit down and decide whether an abysmally sick person, who don’t want to contest would contest or not. And in most cases they would say he must contest because they are enjoying, to the detriment of millions of other people. So this is what normally obtains.
But can you succumb to such blackmail from your aides, if you were in Yar’Adua’s position?
Well like I said earlier where you stand depends on where you sit. Whether I would succumb or not, I can’t say because I don’t sit there.
Recently, some major political actors like Buhari, Atiku and others, have been meeting with a view to forming a united front against the PDP. Do you think such arrangement is capable of threatening PDP’s avowed determination to rule for at least 60 years?
The success of that association– that is if they eventually form a party– would depend on their degree of sincerity.I know all these people.I wish them  luck. But I don’t, with the exception of one or two persons, see how these people can dislodge the PDP. In fact, put succinctly, there is no way all of them put together can dislodge PDP from power, looking at the fact on the ground. When you go to Sokoto, Attahiru Bafarawa can be said to have maybe about a quarter of the total voters. And when you talk about AC as a party, where Atiku holds sway, it has two states Lagos and Edo . Like I said earlier, I wish them luck. But they have to look at the arrangement again.
Many strongly believe that the only recipe for credible elections in the country in 2011 and beyond is the introduction of meaningful electoral reforms. What is your position on this?
The truth is that we definitely need electoral reforms in this country. You see, all along, the votes of Nigerians, have not been counting in elections. And with the experience of the last 10 years. Some measures of reforms are needed so that we can achieve political progress. I believe in and have been fighting for the reform, and I have been collaborating with a lot of people, in order to bring about the needed electoral reforms.
But your party the PDP doesn’t seem to be ready for the kind of reforms many Nigerians want?
Whether the party likes it or not, I believe that it is only an electoral reform that would ensure that each and every person in Nigeria is happy politically including members of the PDP. I know that the people who have benefited from our past flawed elections, would not support an electoral reform. But then, it is an on-going struggle and I believe that at a point it would succeed.
Your governor, Ibrahim Shekarau is believed strongly to be eyeing the presidency. Even though you are not of the same party, how do you receive his ambition?
Honestly, I don’t want to speak on Shekarau and his ambition. In fact, his political ambition doesn’t bother me. As far as I am concerned, that is my position.
Your posters presently adorned many parts of Kano . So what do we expect from you in 2011?
Yes, I am waiting for my people to tell me what to do for now. Being in politics and contesting for elective positions for me is not just a matter of interest. It is a matter of duty. I know I must do something, but I am waiting for my people to tell me what I will do for them.
The belief in many circles in Kano is that you would be a very good material for a national assignment, but that you are too arrogant to win election as Kano State Governor. How do you react to this?
Well, I am sure if I stand for election in Kano, majority of the masses would vote for me. This is what I know. And that is regardless of whether I am interested in becoming the governor of Kano state or not. But today, if there is an election, the masses of Kano would vote for me.
Why do you think so?
This is because I know so. I know what they want. And I know they want me. In any case, what is arrogance? Look people only say I am arrogant because I am fighting the cause of the masses. And if, the establishment in Kano feels that I am arrogant to them, then they are not the masses of Kano.
Even though in politics they say “There is no permanent friend or enemy”, it is strange that you have mended fences with Kwankwaso. But with the party still in his firm control, as well as his rumoured ambition to still contest for the governorship seat, don’t you think your ambition and those of others within the PDP would clash with that of Kwankwaso and then may tear the party apart as it did in 2007?
The PDP in Kano is a party that is now democratic. Personally, I feel that part of my responsibility as a leader is to help my people live a good life. And that good life  includes allowing the people to have some measure of stability in their political life. That was what I and Dr. Kwankwaso have decided to bring about in the PDP. We are not personal enemies as such or as people tend to believe. We only had political differences, which we have decided in the interest of the people to bury and come together to do something positive about.
I believe that at the end of the day, people would appreciate this arrangement. I believe also that with time, democracy is going to prevail in the PDP in Kano. That is what Kwankwaso wants. And that is what I also want. But there are people who would not rest until they see that they control the PDP in Kano . Unfortunately, however, they don’t have the people. That is our only concern now. But one thing is certain and that is, these people would never have their way. Therefore, as far as I am concerned the PDP in Kano is stable enough to go into the election in 2011.
In the face of the apparent failed state of the nation, do you still see a bright future for the country?
Definitely there is a bright future for Nigeria . That is because Nigerians interact very well among themselves today. Democracy in the last 10 years if nothing else, has helped to increase contact between as many Nigerians as possible. And that has reduced the frictions among Nigerians. Everyday, Nigerians are knowing more about themselves and Nigeria . They are presently going into ventures together, which before now they couldn’t do. Therefore, this resilience among Nigerians would definitely go a long way in ensuring that Nigeria as a country has a great future. My recipe for that great future is that Nigerians must begin to appreciate one another no matter the differences, and where the person comes from. Whoever has the best qualities; they should go for him at any given time, whether at the local council, State or Federal level. Nigerians should begin to identify people who have good qualities and abilities and elect them into offices so that the country can move forward.